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    Invelos Forums->General: General Discussion Page: 1 2 3 ...6  Previous   Next
Creating my own online movie database
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DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantmovie_madness
Registered: August 7, 2007
Posts: 102
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DVD Profiler is a great product -- for its time.  Now it just seems inadequate in a lot of ways.  I mentioned this in an old thread about 2 years ago, where I said DVDP's inadequacies caused me to take matters into my own hands by creating my own movie database. 

And that I did.  Here are some sample pages of my database that you can check out by logging on with "guest" (no quotes) as user name and password.  Note that my whole database is online and fully searchable and accessible anywhere anytime, which DVDP can't do with its outdated mobile features. 

As I said in the old thread, I programmatically imported IMDb data into my database.  I know many of you are haters of IMDb, but let's face reality here.  IMDb has millions and millions of volunteer contributors, and DVDP has, what, a few hundred maybe?  IMDb has millions and millions of films including many not on home video.  And DVDP still has plenty of DVDs released 10 years ago that still have blank credits and other incomplete info (e.g. Kino's DVD edition of "Carmen/The Cheat", and many IVL DVDs of Shaw Brothers movies).  So you all need to accept the fact that DVDP is just never going to keep up with IMDb in terms of the completeness of the database.  This is not 10 years ago anymore.  Maybe in the early days of IMDb, DVDP had an edge, but that's no longer true.  As every year goes by, DVDP lags behind IMDb further and further.  I know you guys keep claiming DVDP is more accurate, but again, this is not 10 years ago.  The millions of volunteers that have ever worked on IMDb have resulted in a database that is pretty accurate too.  My experience has been that I have noticed more missing info on DVDP than I have on IMDb.

To point out the obvious, DVDP needs more contributors.  In order to do that, it needs more customers.  To do that, DVDP has to have features attractive to modern users, not users from 10 years ago.  I don't know how this will ever be accomplished.  The lack of manpower will always be the bane of software like DVDP compared to the huge mass of people that contribute to IMDb.  And DVDP can't just import IMDb data due to legalities, and has to create all data from scratch.

Another thing is the lack of any meaningful cloud features.  Our online profiles (see mine here) can hardly be called a cloud feature since they offer very little searchability and interactibility.  Ken, if you are reading this, you should have had a FULL-FEATURE CLOUD VERSION of DVDP in the works long ago.  I see you haven't updated DVDP in almost 2 years, so I hope you are planning a major overhaul, because this is really the time to do it.  Look at my online database that I can use anywhere anytime.  This is what people want nowadays.  ANYWHERE, ANYTIME.  Don't you know that database-driven applications such as yours are TAILOR-MADE for online lookups, edits, browsing, etc.?  (As opposed to other types of applications such as worksheets, graphics-editing, etc., which can lead to clunky cloud apps.)

If I were able to put my own database online, others would be too, and I should think it would be no problem for you, Ken.  Nowadays there are free web-hosting sites that let you upload databases such as MS Access, SQL, etc., for free and even support dynamic web pages like ASP, PHP, etc.  It is a relative piece of cake to get an online, database-driven webpages such as mine running. 

The current iOS and Android mobile versions of DVDP have to use WiFi to connect to nearest PC, which in turn needs to have the local DVDP data.  That is so last century, Ken.  When people hear the word "mobile" nowadays, they assume they can access their data anytime & anywhere, not having to be stuck near their PC to do it.  Your mobile apps allow only one way to have truly mobile data, and that is to transfer ALL DVDP data to your mobile device.  Who is going to put gigabytes of data on their smartphones like that, where storage space is precious?  And who is going to wait 5-10 minutes for the transfer every time?

So, to summarize: add attractive features (preferrably cloud-based), get more customers, get more contributors, and you will have a more complete database.  I know these are all tall tasks, but there really needs to be a paradigm shift here.

Frankly, I'm not confident that anything would be improved.  Disc-cataloguing software is an endangered species to begin with, when more and more people nowadays buy online movies from Vudu, iTunes, and the likes.  Those places already do a great job of cataloguing your collection.  On Vudu, I can go to the movies I own, click on the cast and crew,  find out about other movies by the same actors/crew that I also own or don't own, and if I don't, I can order it right way.  DVDP will never beat that.  DVDP can't even catalog digital movies.

Cloud to DVDP is like IMDb to Leonard Maltin's movie guide.  Has anyone seen Maltin's book lately?  That historic, once-great book is pathetic now.  While IMDb has millions of titles, Maltin's book has only 25,000 titles.  It has no short films at all, no made-for-TV films at all, and foreign films are lacking.  Its problem is the same one DVDP has: lack of manpower.  Lack of manpower = lack of GOOD DATA.  Good data are the foundation of enterprises like Maltin's book and DVDP.

And don't get me started on the cover pictures from DVDP.  There are far too many times where the back cover picture is missing.  To compound matters, some of your contributors simply uploaded the front cover as the back cover, which does nothing more than WASTING MY HARD DRIVE SPACE with a duplicate image. 

All these reasons are why I took matters into my own hand.  I can design my database in any way I want (including allowing Unicode characters) and access it online as well.  I use Microsoft Access to develop my database, which is not free nor cheap.  But there are plenty of free database programs, notably MySQL.  Microsoft also secretly offers its industrial-strength SQL Server FOR FREE as well, the only catch being the 4-gigabyte size limit, which regular folks will never exceed anyway.
 Last edited: by movie_madness
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributoremmeli
www.myprofiler.de
Registered: June 26, 2013
Reputation: High Rating
Germany Posts: 694
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DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantmovie_madness
Registered: August 7, 2007
Posts: 102
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Some pages on that site are phishing pages, such as this one.  But not all are, and mine certainly isn't.  There are far more reputable database hosting sites, of course, but some are paid services.  The point remains that it is very feasible and affordable for many people to put up their own online movie databases.
 Last edited: by movie_madness
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLewis_Prothero
Strength Through Unity
Registered: May 19, 2007
Reputation: Superior Rating
Germany Posts: 6,730
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For several reasons this thread should be removed.
It all seems so stupid, it makes me want to give up!
But why should I give up, when it all seems so stupid?


Registrant since 05/22/2003
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorKathy
Registered: May 29, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 3,475
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I took a quick peek and it doesn't suit me.

I much prefer the design and formatting of profiler and if I'm looking for expanded data I will go to IMDb.

Some of the other things you mention are of no use to me. For example, I have no need to access or view my collection anywhere or anytime.

The contribution process for profiler also suits my purposes. There are a few bugs and disagreements on some things of course but for the most part things are fairly easy.

I have quite a large collection and seldom run into problems you mention. Out of the 15,000+ titles I own only a few have the front cover duplicated on the back. And, if they do I contribute the back cover.

It's great that you have the time and inclination to set things up the way you like. But, I'm old and I don't favor change easily.

I've looked at many other collection products and I haven't found any that compares to invelos' software. I just like the way profiler looks and how it works.

There are improvements that should be made, and customer service might be lacking, but generally speaking I'm happy with what I've got.
 Last edited: by Kathy
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantmovie_madness
Registered: August 7, 2007
Posts: 102
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Kathy, the reason improvements to DVDP are slow to come by is because DVDP is built on an ARCHAIC platform that is tough to program and tough to manage.  Ask Ken, and I *guarantee* you that he would say that he would much prefer developing an online, cloud-based system that (a) runs on anything, (b) doesn't need a gazillion different versions for PC, Mac, PocketPC, Android, iOS, etc., (c) and you can ask Ken about this: MUCH easier to program.  That's why EVERYBODY is developing things like this.  You are posting on the VERY FORUM that is cloud-based, which lets you post and view anywhere anytime.  Kathy, I understand you don't need the mobility, but if Ken doesn't offer something that many people want and ARE using, he won't have a product to support in the future, and when that happens, you won't have a product to use.

Ken has got to understand that his data are ALREADY online, but he just doesn't have a cloud product to take advantage.  We use DVDP to download disc info via Internet.  Why do we download data from the Internet, then upload them back again to our Internet online profiles, then download them again to our mobile devices??  Why not have a cloud-based system where data STAY on the cloud?  As I said, it needs a paradigm shift around here.  If his customers don't support it, he likely won't do it.  Do you all want DVDP to go obsolete and go away?  Kathy, if DVDP is gone, what are you going to do with your 15,000+ titles in your DVDP profile?
 Last edited: by movie_madness
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
United States Posts: 2,851
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Quoting movie_madness:
Quote:
Why do we download data from the Internet, then upload them back again to our Internet online profiles, then download them again to our mobile devices??  Why not have a cloud-based system where data STAY on the cloud?

I like being able to have local copies of my data that don't depend on "the cloud" to function.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorLJG
Registered: March 14, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
United States Posts: 950
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Quoting movie_madness:
Quote:
Ken has got to understand that his data are ALREADY online, but he just doesn't have a cloud product to take advantage.  We use DVDP to download disc info via Internet.  Why do we download data from the Internet, then upload them back again to our Internet online profiles, then download them again to our mobile devices??  Why not have a cloud-based system where data STAY on the cloud?  As I said, it needs a paradigm shift around here.  If his customers don't support it, he likely won't do it.  Do you all want DVDP to go obsolete and go away?  Kathy, if DVDP is gone, what are you going to do with your 15,000+ titles in your DVDP profile?


But the thing is, if the cloud goes down, I still have access to the information. It's on my computer, plus I have backups. At that point, I might not be able to access it through the cloud, but I still have it. I just would have to update it by hand. I don't think this is the tragedy you're trying to make it seem.

Plus, your use of IMDb data could get you in a lot of trouble. They require companies to pay for that data. If it's for your own use, I think you're fine, but once you start offering to others (especially if you make them pay which I don't know if you do), that is considered stealing and I know IMDb frowns on that. I believe they charge in the thousands of dollars for use of that data.

Is the cloud handy? Yes, sometimes. But I don't think that's the be all end all of all technology. It'd be nice to have a fully functioning online database that we could share, but I'd be very disappointed if the software version I use goes away. I also have the mobile version. I use it to make sure I don't double dip at stores. Would I like a faster refresh/update speed? Yes, but for what I use it for, it's just fine.

I agree with Kathy that I think customer service is lacking and there are definite things that need improvement, but having looked at what's out there, this is still the best for the price and what you get.
Lori
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorAddicted2DVD
Registered: March 13, 2007
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All I will say is I agree with Kathy and Lori.
Pete
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorTheMadMartian
Alien with an attitude
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 13,202
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I agree with Pete's agreement with Kathy and Lori.

I don't want a 'cloud' program.  I want a local copy of my database that I can take with me anywhere I go.
No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorateo357
Registered: December 27, 2009
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 5,131
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0 contributions in 7 years. just another useless member, complaining about not enough contributors, In my opinion you and your database can fade back into oblivion.
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantmovie_madness
Registered: August 7, 2007
Posts: 102
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All of you use DVDP to DOWNLOAD disc info with your Internet connection, do you not?  Then you are ALREADY using cloud-like features.  You are already relying on data that are not stored on your PC alone, but online.  Almost everything your PC does REQUIRES online features.  Windows need to download updates online.  Anti-virus programs need to download updates daily from the Internet.  When you buy a program, you often need to activate it online.  Nowadays, you CANNOT run a totally stand-alone PC.  More to the point, most of you are ALREADY using some sort of cloud features on a daily basis and don't seem to realize it.

TheMadMartian, don't you find your statement oxymoronic: "I want a local copy of my database that I can take with me anywhere I go."  If you want something anywhere you go, CLOUD is the thing.  I don't see how you are going to bring a PC software anywhere you go without hauling your PC around everywhere you go.

To LJG's point, many cloud services DO let you backup your data to a local copy.  DVDP already can upload your collection to an online profile, so I'm sure the reverse is possible too.  The difference is that in a cloud service, the cloud data is the MAIN COPY, not the local data.

DVDP is not going to last forever the way it is.  Look at the feature request forum.  That place used to be filled with posts, and now it is seldom posted on, an indication that the program is nowhere nearly as popular as it used to be.  It used to be THE go-to app for movie collection.

When you need to update disc info, DVDP has you do a massive global update on ALL discs.  Don't you know how last century that is?  If the data is on the cloud, you don't need to DO A THING.  The data is updated automatically in the cloud server without you ever knowing it.  THAT'S PROGRESS.  This society is built on progress.  Don't you people want to make the program better?
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantmovie_madness
Registered: August 7, 2007
Posts: 102
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Quoting ateo357:
Quote:
0 contributions in 7 years. just another useless member, complaining about not enough contributors, In my opinion you and your database can fade back into oblivion.


Where does it say in the product EULA that I have to contribute?  All I had to do was PAY for the software, and that I did.  DVDP's database relies on VOLUNTEERS.  Do you know what that word means? It means I'm not required to contribute.  I never contributed to IMDb and wiki either, and they are doing pretty well, aren't they?  The point REMAINS that even if every single DVDP member and their family, relatives, pets, gold fish, etc., ALL contribute, this product is still never ever going to keep up with the breadth and depth of IMDb.  You just need to face that fact.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
United States Posts: 2,851
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Quoting movie_madness:
Quote:
If the data is on the cloud, you don't need to DO A THING.  The data is updated automatically in the cloud server without you ever knowing it.  THAT'S PROGRESS.

The day DVD Profiler works that way is the day I'll stop using it.  I don't want it to update any of my data behind my back.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantmovie_madness
Registered: August 7, 2007
Posts: 102
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Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
Quoting movie_madness:
Quote:
If the data is on the cloud, you don't need to DO A THING.  The data is updated automatically in the cloud server without you ever knowing it.  THAT'S PROGRESS.

The day DVD Profiler works that way is the day I'll stop using it.  I don't want it to update any of my data behind my back.

---------------


I'm guessing the reason you don't want automatic updates is that you fear that BAD DATA may come through, am I right?  I'm the same way.  The cause of that is, again, there are nowhere nearly enough contributors to create timely, swift, and most importantly, reliable updates and corrections to the database.  That's why every time you update disc info, you are shown detailed info on what was updated and what was added, as if to reassure you, but it only adds to the cumbersome nature of the program.  My point is that your thinking has nothing to do with cloud.  It has to do with lack of contributors and lack of good data.  As I said, to get more contributors and more customers, you need attractive features in the program.  It won't get as many contributors as IMDb has, but at least you try to get more.  But it seems this program is losing customers steadily.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorateo357
Registered: December 27, 2009
Reputation: Highest Rating
United States Posts: 5,131
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Quoting movie_madness:
Quote:
Quoting ateo357:
Quote:
0 contributions in 7 years. just another useless member, complaining about not enough contributors, In my opinion you and your database can fade back into oblivion.


Where does it say in the product EULA that I have to contribute?  All I had to do was PAY for the software, and that I did.  DVDP's database relies on VOLUNTEERS.  Do you know what that word means? It means I'm not required to contribute.  I never contributed to IMDb and wiki either, and they are doing pretty well, aren't they?  The point REMAINS that even if every single DVDP member and their family, relatives, pets, gold fish, etc., ALL contribute, this product is still never ever going to keep up with the breadth and depth of IMDb.  You just need to face that fact.



1. You don't have to contribute and you also do not have to particpate in the forums. And you have gotten more than what you paid for 7 years ago.

2. Volunteers - people who give their time and effort without expecting anything for it. Taker - a person who always wants more without putting any effort into it.

3. I contribute to both IMDB and Wiki.

4. The point is this program and IMDB are 2 very different types of data programs.

5. The fact is, your database page is lacking. It actually looks like something from the DOS era.
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